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On 1/25/2024 at 5:35 PM, peethagoras said:

Dugdale also wrote "freind" and not "frend". And he changed "encloased" to "inclosed". He also expanded the thorn-t, and thorn-y (Yt and Ye) abbreviations.

 

The text has always been substantially as we see it today, Dugdale himself proves that.

If I had carried out the biggest cover up (even if it was for all the right reasons that this had to be concealed) I’d definitely leave a clue for posterity hiding in plain sight that Shakespeare was a pen name   - and I’d think that this monument and grave would be the perfect place to do it as people would be pausing and looking at it. Indeed they are asked to do that!
 

What I wouldn’t know in advance is whether people who suspected what me and my friends had done, who also wanted to keep it quiet (for whatever reason, not neccessarily good ones this time) might change my clues after mine and my friends’ deaths.
 

I ‘quote copied’ some of the specific  comments you made above as it’s my understanding from the article I wrote on the monument (but AP is the expert on all this) that Dugdale wrote (or recorded?) the original inscription and Hollar engraved it, but there have been all the subsequent changes to the bust (which has resulted in the porky odd guy who is there today) AND the inscription. 
 

If you look there have  been slight changes over time including the plac’t to plac’d to plast and the loss and/or insertion of extra t on writ and wit and other things.
 

Same with the grave and ‘curse those who move my bones ’ inscription. There have apparently been very slight changes to the inscription. This has been blamed on renovations and changing times and different engraving tools etc - but to cipher experts these are changes which may completely alter any intentionally encoded message.

Everyone looks at the latest but that is the one that should definitely be disregarded as it is not the original.

Remember in Bacon’s biliteral cipher just the slightest tweak to a serif mark on a T can change a cipher. If it’s a Gematria code then changing a letter changes the numbers. Depends what they did ( if anything).

For this reason it is very important that we try and ascertain the original. However, with no photography in those days we are probably most reliant on the Dugdale image as being the closest.
 

Here you can see the changes to the words in the inscription over time. So yes, substantially the same but a potential world apart if there is cipher.IMG_1261.jpeg.4be57e214838dfd8be3dca9697e755f0.jpegIMG_1314.png.a2f66bf6f2c27e44de3a2cfac4e5c87b.pngIMG_1315.jpeg.25f1512aee5d5f313f0ad5eb9032bba2.jpeg

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 "For nothing is born without unity or without the point." amazon.com/dp/B0CLDKDPY8

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We are unable to say what the original spelling was, it's been so long, and much work has been done, but concerning the basic text on the plaque: We are told that Shakespeare had the judgement of Nestor (Pylium), the genius of Socrates and the art or skill of Virgil (Maronem). Surely these attributes can't be applied to the English 'Bard'? and they certainly couldn't have applied to the glove-making wool merchant. So I ask myself, was there really an effigy of a man clutching a wool-sack to his nether regions? Or was Dugdale having a laugh? I know for a fact that there's another effigy, where a real feather is used: John Stowe, London: his first original work was The Chronicles of England (1580).

 https://www.merchant-taylors.co.uk/news/john-stow-merchant-taylor-and-the-history-of-london

His effigy could have been behind the Stratford design. Stowe was alive when the sonnets were being composed. He mentions Shakespeare somewhere or other, I have forgotten now, but Stowe was known to John Dee and Ben Jonson, so I suppose he might have been a member of the R C. What say you on that?

I pose this question: If Bacon's followers believed him to some kind of divinity, given that not just the gravestones and monument, but the Stratford church itself, could be destroyed, and the original First Folio copies, and those of the Sonnets: all destroyed over the centuries, what then for the hidden truth which was of such great importance? Where then would the monument be found to Francis Bacon?

 

 

 

 

 

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The man in the moone was not a buffoon

 

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1 hour ago, peethagoras said:

I pose this question: If Bacon's followers believed him to some kind of divinity, given that not just the gravestones and monument, but the Stratford church itself, could be destroyed, and the original First Folio copies, and those of the Sonnets: all destroyed over the centuries, what then for the hidden truth which was of such great importance? Where then would the monument be found to Francis Bacon?

Pretty good, Pee! 🙂

Where inDeed? LOL

alledewerckensoo00cats_0683.jpg.7f750270d403b293c7e22b6415187730.jpg

 

EDIT: adding link that came up in search, but might not be right (page 108):

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/89/Spiegel_van_den_ouden_ende_nieuvven_tijdt_-_bestaende_uyt_spreeck-woorden_ende_sinne-spreucken%2C_ontleent_van_de_voorige_ende_jegenwoordige_eeuwe_(IA_spiegelvandenoud00cats_3).pdf

 

 

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T A A A A A A A A A A A T
157     www.Light-of-Truth.com     287
<-- 1 8 8 1 1
O 1 1 8 8 1 -->

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2 hours ago, peethagoras said:

I know for a fact that there's another effigy, where a real feather is used: John Stowe, London: his first original work was The Chronicles of England (1580).

I love this quote from the link you shared:

This shows him seated at his desk, writing and surrounded by books. Above is the motto aut scribenda agere, aut legenda scribere ('Either do things worth writing about, or write things worth reading').

🙂

 

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T A A A A A A A A A A A T
157     www.Light-of-Truth.com     287
<-- 1 8 8 1 1
O 1 1 8 8 1 -->

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Hi Peethagoras,

I have not the answer, but your question reminded some of my research following the day I learned that Phoenix was the name of a wind.

I decided to follow the Phoenix wind from Rhodes ( Rhodon meaning Rose in Greek) and to see what could be find at circa 444 miles from Rhodes.

This is how I found the St George Monastery of St Khatalba Benwa in Egypt.

At that time, there was a statue of St George slaying the Dragon that seems to have disappeared since then.

image.png.5737ca913b668e9fbbebfd3b3deedc1f.png

This monastery being not too far from the Pyramid of Kheops, a thought came to my mind. What if ? 🙂 

I decided to trace a line going from Westminster Abbey to the Pyramid of Kheops and ... surprise !

image.png.d7a6b7f5970e096b42a9659a814681bc.png

The pedestal of the Statue is perfectly in axis with the "Westminter Abbey- Pyramid" line.

I know that it probably means nothing but it is cool ! 😊

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Interesting stuff Allisnum2er! (Whyfor that name btw? Dee? or the man from Samos?) And why choose a circle of 444 miles? Signify 4 me please?

Re Rhoda etc: Did you read my little effort re Rhoda?

Re St George: did you read my little effort re the "curst" tomb, Clarence and George etc?

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The man in the moone was not a buffoon

 

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Thanks Light-of-Truth for that. I have seen that Flemish image before, it is said to be the transfer of knowledge from Dee to Bacon, but I don't really know. It is true that Bacon wore roses on his shoes etc, and in the image the man with the tri-hat does wear a D-shaped (Droeshout) collar. It is interesting that the sub text quotes from The Book of Numbers 20:23 etc, of particular interest is regarding MOSES isn't it.

If this image really did symbolize Dee passing the light to Bacon, then might not Dee be of some great importance also?

 

In passing, I seem to have difficulty replying to each respondent in turn. How does one reply to an individual from one's post?  I can't seem to get that 'Quote' button to function.

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The man in the moone was not a buffoon

 

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30 minutes ago, peethagoras said:

Interesting stuff Allisnum2er! (Whyfor that name btw? Dee? or the man from Samos?) And why choose a circle of 444 miles? Signify 4 me please?

Re Rhoda etc: Did you read my little effort re Rhoda?

Re St George: did you read my little effort re the "curst" tomb, Clarence and George etc?

I will keep the principal reason of my pseudo secret 😊. But I can tell you that the two other reasons are because I love numbers and because the simple cipher of Allisnum2er (or All is number) is 119 that is the simple cipher of MEDIOCRIA FIRMA (Francis Bacon's motto) and ROSE CROIX (the French for ROSIE CROSS) 😉

I choose 444 because I was looking for a temple.

                                         ... till within soare

Of Towring Eagles, to all the Fowles he seems

A Phoenix, gaz'd by all, as that sole Bird

When to enshrine his reliques in the Sun's

Bright Temple, to Aegyptian Theb's he flies.

(Paradise Lost - Milton)

444 is the gematria of Mikdash (Temple) and for me, 44 is the gematria of Yeled (Son), Dam (Blood) and chol (Phoenix) ... "The Son with the Blood of the Phoenix".

I think that I read your little effort on the "curst tomb" and George, but I do not remember having read your take on rhoda.

Edit :

444 = 157 + 287 (Thanks to Light-of-Truth 🙂 )

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2 minutes ago, peethagoras said:

In passing, I seem to have difficulty replying to each respondent in turn. How does one reply to an individual from one's post?  I can't seem to get that 'Quote' button to function.

I highlight with my mouse and click "Quote". The reply is below the post, at least the latest post, but the quote appears like above wherever the Reply box is.

May be that after a while it goes to the next page if there are several replies? I don't even know! LOL

image.png.976a20453b18c31a8cbe2a9cf91bcfcf.png

The image of Dee passing the Lamp to Bacon is bigger than those two guys, in my vision. It's passing the Light from the Past to the Future, whatever the Light is.

I like to think of it as the Light of Truth, whatever that is, but my belief is partly because it adds up to 157 Simple and 287 Kaye cipher. 😉

image.png.89e0fa8377bc7728e29bf08bd7dafdfb.png

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T A A A A A A A A A A A T
157     www.Light-of-Truth.com     287
<-- 1 8 8 1 1
O 1 1 8 8 1 -->

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9 minutes ago, peethagoras said:

In passing, I seem to have difficulty replying to each respondent in turn. How does one reply to an individual from one's post?  I can't seem to get that 'Quote' button to function.

Indeed ! 🙂 you can quote the entire post or you can select a part of it and you will see "Quote the selection" appear 😉 

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4 minutes ago, Allisnum2er said:

I choose 444 because I was looking for a temple.

And of course we must remember that it is the combined total of the two Secret Shakespearean Seal numbers added together.

157 plus 287 equals 444.

😉

 

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T A A A A A A A A A A A T
157     www.Light-of-Truth.com     287
<-- 1 8 8 1 1
O 1 1 8 8 1 -->

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5 hours ago, peethagoras said:

We are unable to say what the original spelling was, it's been so long, and much work has been done, but concerning the basic text on the plaque: We are told that Shakespeare had the judgement of Nestor (Pylium), the genius of Socrates and the art or skill of Virgil (Maronem). Surely these attributes can't be applied to the English 'Bard'? and they certainly couldn't have applied to the glove-making wool merchant. So I ask myself, was there really an effigy of a man clutching a wool-sack to his nether regions? Or was Dugdale having a laugh? I know for a fact that there's another effigy, where a real feather is used: John Stowe, London: his first original work was The Chronicles of England (1580).

 https://www.merchant-taylors.co.uk/news/john-stow-merchant-taylor-and-the-history-of-london

His effigy could have been behind the Stratford design. Stowe was alive when the sonnets were being composed. He mentions Shakespeare somewhere or other, I have forgotten now, but Stowe was known to John Dee and Ben Jonson, so I suppose he might have been a member of the R C. What say you on that?

I pose this question: If Bacon's followers believed him to some kind of divinity, given that not just the gravestones and monument, but the Stratford church itself, could be destroyed, and the original First Folio copies, and those of the Sonnets: all destroyed over the centuries, what then for the hidden truth which was of such great importance? Where then would the monument be found to Francis Bacon?

 

 

 

 

 

JohnStow.jpeg.2166d78dccbe7f28beb442b34f5b014c.jpeg

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:St_Andrew_Undershaft,_St_Mary_Axe,_EC2_-_Wall_monument_of_John_Stow_-_geograph.org.uk_-_1491412.jpg

The figure holds a real quill pen, in a manner similar to the effigy of William Shakespeare at Stratford-upon-Avon: the latter monument has been attributed, on equally tentative grounds, either to Nicholas Johnson's brother, Gerard, or more recently to Nicholas himself.

The sculpture of John Stow in St Andrew Undershaft is full-length, depicting the author sitting at his writing table. The Shakespeare monument is truncated. Given that the present monument at Stratford dates from the second half of the 17th century, Stow's monument could not be the prototype of the original Shakespeare effigy as recorded by Dugdale.

ScreenShot2024-01-28at11_34_08am.png.33466cac95b93749364f457e913aa30b.png

When it was decided to replace the original sculpture in Holy Trinity Church, Stratford, the Stow monument may well have provided a suitable model for the figure of "Shakespeare" we see today. (Who paid for John Stow's expensive marble shrine? It is said that his wife commissioned the sculpture, but apparently Stow was far from wealthy, having self-funded a lifetime of research.)

 

Thank you for bringing John Stow to my attention.

https://www.merchant-taylors.co.uk/news/john-stow-merchant-taylor-and-the-history-of-london

city_st_andrew_undershaft191214_.jpeg.c01ef997f6a7f3b207de7a4d7f79661c.jpeg

St Andrew Undershaft

ScreenShot2024-01-28at11_53_45am.png.99b4eba4e580959735a32b341bbe492e.png

 

Edited by Eric Roberts
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From memory, the Stratford monument used to have a real feather. Apparently it got stolen so often they had to stop using a real one! Nice to hear about this monument. It does look like someone ‘borrowed’ from the Stratford one a bit.
 

You will have heard a lot of Stow on here Eric, he’s the one who wrote out the names of the best poets of the era and put Francis Bacon way above Will Shakespeare (and we can’t be sure the Shakespeare bit wasn’t added by someone else as I believe he died before being able to finish much of his massive tome(s).

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 "For nothing is born without unity or without the point." amazon.com/dp/B0CLDKDPY8

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6 hours ago, Kate said:

From memory, the Stratford monument used to have a real feather. Apparently it got stolen so often they had to stop using a real one! Nice to hear about this monument. It does look like someone ‘borrowed’ from the Stratford one a bit.
 

You will have heard a lot of Stow on here Eric, he’s the one who wrote out the names of the best poets of the era and put Francis Bacon way above Will Shakespeare (and we can’t be sure the Shakespeare bit wasn’t added by someone else as I believe he died before being able to finish much of his massive tome(s).

Thanks Kate. You're right. A Phoenix posted this link last September:

https://www.google.fr/books/edition/Annales_or_a_general_Chronicle_of_Englan/PSxDAAAAcAAJ?hl=fr&gbpv=1&dq=annales+or+general+chronicle+of+england&printsec=frontcover

ScreenShot2024-01-29at8_11_51am.png.d9f0c9dca20b008031c5195ea3d491c1.png

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